Do We Really Care About Democracy? #IranElection
Friday, June 19, 2009 21:46
After being victims of multiple false and propagandistic media campaigns one would think that we would be able to read between the lines when our mainstream media sources act in lockstep with one another in marketing the agenda du jour.
Have we already forgotten the “flowers and candy” which the gracious Iraqi people were going to greet us with? You know, as “Liberators.” The weapons of mass destruction? The fear campaign waged against us to surrender our national treasure to a few Wall Street firms? When the mainstream media moves together in uniform, repeating the same talking points, it’s time to get suspicious, not complacent.
As soon as Ahmadinejad was declared the victor in Iran’s election EACH of our mainstream media sources were ready to cry foul and dismiss the results as an “obvious” fraud (see links below). One might think that a functioning media would produce ONE inquisitive reporter that was brave enough to even entertain the idea that Ahmadinejad, the incumbent with extremely high support in the country’s rural and poor areas, actually won. Unfortunately, we don’t have reporters like that in our mainstream media (which is why their readership continues to plummet).
If you doubt that the Iranian election media bombardment was deliberate, ask yourself – Do you know who won last months Panamanian election ? Did you even know there was an election? It’s not your fault if you don’t. Actually, I don’t see how you could know without a functioning media.
Have you heard much about the democratic elections in Saudi Arabia lately? Of course not. They don’t have elections. Any media outrage for the people of Saudi Arabia? A country ruled by one of the most repressive regimes on the planet. But hey, they’re our allies. We don’t talk about them (and certainly won’t tweet it).
What about the 2006 (monitored) democratic election in Gaza in which the people resisted western threats and bribes and elected Hamas as their leader? We responded by punishing the people of Gaza and cutting aid to the region. Well, they committed a supreme crime. They voted the wrong way and must be punished for it. I’m waiting for a sympathetic #GazaElection hashtag on Twitter, though I won’t hold my breathe.
Have you heard ANYTHING from the mainstream media of the democratically elected governments that we REMOVED? The fact is that we don’t care about democratic elections.
Dr. Michael Parenti, is one of the nations leading political scholars. In his book “Against Empire,” Parenti tells us that “The United States has overthrown democratically elected governments in Guatemala, Guyana, The Dominican Republic, Brazil, Chile, Uruguay, Syria, Indonesia, Greece, Argentina, Bolivia, Haiti, and numerous other nations were overthrown by pro-capitalist militaries that were funded and aided by the US national security state.”
The #IranElection hype has nothing to do with democracy and everything to do with effecting US public opinion. Why are “Iranian’s” microblogging in English and on Twitter (which they do NOT use)? According to Mehdi Yahyanejad, manager of a Farsi-language news site based in Los Angeles, “Twitter’s impact inside Iran is zero..here, there is lots of buzz, but once you look . . . you see most of it are Americans tweeting among themselves.” The Alexa rankings confirm that Twitter’s penetration in Iran is nearly 0%.
The United States is the last country on earth that Iran wants attention from. They certainly don’t want us involved in their elections. We’ve already removed a democratically elected government in Iran during the 1953 coup d’etat of Iranian Prime Minister Mohammed Mosaddeq. I’d venture to guess that most of the people expressing sympathy for the “Iranian Students” on twitter would have a hard time finding Iran on a map. Those that could would quickly realize that on either side Iran’s borders lies 2 countries which we are very familiar with – Iraq and Afghanistan. Both of which are militarily occupied by our armies. Both ruled by our puppet governments.
Ask yourself – If Iran’s army invaded and occupied both Canada and Mexico, would we want their “Help”? Would we find popular Iranian websites and keep them informed of our nation’s vulnerabilities in their native Farsi?
The media campaign, however obvious it is to some of us, has probably been successful. I’ll bet that if you poll the American people today (and they probably will), you’d find that 40-50% would support military involvement in Iran to “Help” with their elections. I’d also assume that those 40-50% are the same people (more or less) who believed we invaded Iraq because of 9-11, another testament to the effectiveness of propaganda marketing.
[Update June 29: ] CNN Polled US Regarding Iran Intervention (Right on Time) . Respondents do NOT support US military involvement in Iran. My, how far we’ve come.
The Instant “Analysis”:
Reuters Iran’s election result staggers analysts
Hard-liner Mahmoud Ahmadinejad defeated moderate challenger Mirhossein Mousavi by a surprisingly wide margin in Iran’s presidential election, official results showed on Saturday. Mousavi derided the tally as a “dangerous charade.’
Fox News: U.S. Monitoring Iran’s Election Results
U.S. officials are casting doubt over the results of Iran’s election, in which the government declared President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad the winner Saturday…U.S. analysts find it “not credible [Notice the usual UN-NAMED "US Officials and Analysts]
MSNBC: Violence flares as Ahmadinejad wins Iran vote
Riot police battled with protesters Saturday as officials announced that President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had won a landslide election victory. His opponent denounced the results as ‘treason’….Ahmadinejad had the apparent backing of the ruling theocracy.
CNN: Ahmadinejad wins landslide in disputed election
Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad has been declared the big winner in the country’s election, but his chief rival and supporters in the Tehran streets are crying foul.
NY Times: Ahmadinejad Is Declared Victor in Iran
The Iranian government declared an outright election victory for President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on Saturday morning, and riot police officers fought with supporters of the opposition candidate, Mir Hussein Moussavi, who insisted that the election had been stolen.
Time Magazine: Protests Greet Ahmadinejad Win in Iran: ‘It’s Not Possible!
Iran’s Interior Minister announced Saturday that incumbent president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad had won 63.29% of the vote in the nation’s closely watched presidential poll. The announcement, greeted with widespread skepticism by Iranian opposition supporters and by foreign analysts, has brought thousands of people onto the streets where they have encountered a strong police presence and the threat of violence.
Related posts:
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:05 am
Still case to be made for fraud, although there is no conclusive evidence: theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,25656726-15084,00.html charlierose.com/view/interview/10385
fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/did-polling-predict-ahmadinejad-victory.html and tehranbureau.com/2009/06/17/poll-indicating-legitimacy-of-ahmadinejads-victory-called-into-question/
pollster.com/blogs/wang_on_tehrans_preelection_po.php pollster.com/blogs/mebane_moderately_strong_suppo.php timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6523563.ece tampabay.com/news/world/article1011557.ece
openleft.com/diary/13774/on-that-iranian-poll
globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=14019
truthout.org/061409Z
news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/8101621.stm
Brian Mallard says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:09 am
I give @chartingstocks1 a thumb up! Today, America has indeed become a deceptively democratic country run by a bunch of extremely dominant, manipulative Zionist parasites. As America gets deep into this Second Great Depression, those who are brainwashed by the Zionist-controlled media (massive propaganda machine) will be destitute.
Jona says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:20 am
hands down, one of the best posts i’ve seen in a while. you bring up very good points. i wasnt buying the twitter hype either. well done.
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:22 am
Sorry, I gave so many links, but they do raise some interesting points. Look over them and let me know what you think. Right now, it isn’t entirely clear whether there is fraud or not, but there is a case to be made for it. If this is indeed organized by the CIA then the Iranian government is playing into their hands with their lack of openness regarding some of the points/question leveled in these articles. Khamenei’s aggressive response also seems to play into their hands if they are looking for instability. Also, I would venture to say that the CIA is probably involved at some level. It’s no secret that the US government doesn’t like Iran, but the extent of that involvement is unknown if there is any involvement at all. There is no definitive evidence for fraud or intervention in this particular case. What about FSS agents in Iran? Russia has been no saint either during its history and it is one of the Iranian regime’s biggest allies, so it’s also distinctly possible they are lending support here. Twiiter may have had some impact (washingtonpost.com/wpdyn/content/article/2009/06/16/AR2009061603391.html) although you are calling into question whether those alleged Iranians are actually Iranian. English is a much more widespread language than Farsi is, so it does seem more likely that more Iranians would know English then Americans knowing farsi. I do remember hearing that English isn’t that common given our past history with Iran though. These are supposed University students, so it is possible that they’d know English. Also, have you continued to press the JPost for answers to your questions? I believe you should because they seem legitimate to ask.
Fred B says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:34 am
Keep in mind this is the same ‘media’ that called many Americans ‘conspiracy theorists’ when they pointed to fraud in the USA Presidential elections in 2000 and 2004. Regardless of exit poll discrepancies with the 2004 ‘counting’ by voting machines, all people who pointed this out and the exit polls which pointed to fraud were dismissed as ‘crazy whackos’ and ‘unreliable’ by this media. They were too busy telling us about the ‘fraud’ and ‘popular’ uprising occuring in Ukraine during the Orange Revolution – using exit polls as their ‘proof’ of course!
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:56 am
There is still a case to be made for fraud in Iran as shown in the links I provided (there is no conclusive evidence for fraud though) and even if the vote was fair the people in Iran still have a right and legitimate reason to protest given that their government has brutally repressed their rights these last 30 years.
sharon says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:02 pm
Great site – thanks so much for all the info.
The fake twitter campaign first came to my attention when a facebook friend started using the green [where are their votes] pic as his profile pic and tried to get some momentum going on facebook about all the ‘fraud’. It went down like a damp squib. i think it is going to be much harder for hawks to use the progressive left to soften up the public for any kind of action on Iran. Not only is there buyers remorse after the Iraq fiasco but the financial crisis is making people retreat into isolated worlds of hurt and distraction.
chartingstocks1 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:24 pm
HRW…one of the link which you provided globalreasearch..actually debunks the fraud theory…i recommend you read the recent GR post about the “Stolen Election Hoax”..”The careless and distorted emphasis on ‘ethnic voting’ cited by writers from the Financial Times and New York Times to justify calling Ahmadinejad ‘s victory a ‘stolen vote’ is matched by the media’s willful and deliberate refusal to acknowledge a rigorous nationwide public opinion poll conducted by two US experts just three weeks before the vote, which showed Ahmadinejad leading by a more than 2 to 1 margin – even larger than his electoral victory on June 12.” .might it have been stolen? sure..and considering the rhetoric out of Mousavi, I’m sure that their are million of supporters who believe it was stolen.
Nimaso says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:35 pm
Mousavi published the letter he had written to the Gaurdian Council. In that letter he has listed some of the important cases that show why the election is rigged.
For example, in about 170 of the electral zones, the tournout is between 95% to 140% !! In all of these zones Ahmadinejad earned 85 to 95 percent of the votes!
Nimaso says:
June 20th, 2009 at 12:39 pm
Also, none of the three candidates represntatives where allowed into the “accumulation centers”. This is exactly where the major fraud has taken place.
chartingstocks1 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 1:08 pm
NIM. where did you see that info?
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
Yes, I read that global research article you linked to here, but the one I linked to was more open to the possibility of fraud and accounts for more recent research such as Mebane’s analysis of the election results. It simply stated there is no smoking gun for fraud, which is true, but that is going to be hard to find when the government doesn’t allow for independent election monitors. Some of the other links do raise questions that the Iranian regime has simply not answered and debunk using that poll as absolute proof the election wasn’t rigged. It also seems highly improper to rely on just a single poll conducted three weeks before the election. For example, the article is the St. Pete Times mentions how 10 million ballots didn’t have Personal ID numbers, which means they are untraceable. Also from Tampa article, it seems fishy that East Azerbaijan went from 10% support of Ahmadinejad in 2005 to 57% in 2009 when it is Mousavi’s home province. Of course, that is partially an ethnic argument, but a 47% increase is awfully large especially when it is in your opponent’s home province (There is evidence, which may be considered hype which pointed to Mousavi being popular in East Azerbaijan before the election: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,1901667,00.html). I suppose I don’t know enough about East Azerbaijan’s political voting history to make an accurate assessment though (Go to incumbent victorious section in this article: http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2009/06/2009613121740611636.html states that Azeri typically vote for Azeri as they did in 2005). Another irregularity is the fact that 30 towns reported a turnout of above 100% of registered voters (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#31435624). Of course, there is room for error here, but one town (Taft) had a turnout of 141%. That seems highly unusual. Here’s another article that discusses why Mousavi may have made huge inroads in the three weeks since the oft-cited poll (http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/19/opinion/19shane.html?_r=2&pagewanted=2&partner=rss&emc=rss). Another point of suspicion is Khamenei’s immediate certification of the vote when he’s supposed to wait three days to look for and account for irregularities. Make sure you check out the other articles because some them do raise some other doubts.
I’m reposting some of my jumbled links:
pollster.com/blogs/wang_on_tehrans_preelection_po.php
pollster.com/blogs/mebane_moderately_strong_suppo.php
timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article6523563.ece
tampabay.com/news/world/article1011557.ece
Believer says:
June 20th, 2009 at 2:54 pm
Good job for continuing to battle against all the ridiculous media reports/tweets on #iraqelection.
The students shouldn’t be demonstrating against the election results as by all accounts, even considering fraud, the incumbent had the majority support of the masses. They should have focused on the social and political agenda rather than the election results. Violently demonstrating against the election result is effectively undemocratic.
Johnny says:
June 20th, 2009 at 6:56 pm
Considering how America has the collective I.Q. of a pile of dog shit, no.
America doesn’t care enough to the point that if it doesn’t have Paris Hiltons on the front page or dicks and big tits on it, then they couldn’t care less.
America is a dictators wet dream. Most of you inbreds canott find Washington on a map, you (as a collective now) , you know the Bush Royal family doesn’t plan on leaving the public forum anytime soon , (you shitheads are living under a dictatorship, you just haven’t quite figured that part out yet). And you kill people all around the world for it’s resources, and to test new toys, and have a very long history of doing big business deals with brutal dictatorhips around the globe. You drop jets onto your own citizens and do nothing when the clues are all around you that it was in fact carried out and planned years ahead of time by the very people you pay to invest your tax dollars.
It is gonna be so nice to see you stupid fucks rot away in your own Halliburton death camps, for the simple reason, you are too stupid, too fucking fat and lazy and too far gone and unconnected to reality to be free. Let’s hope you die in agony and very slowly and those who have suffered and lost loved ones while you all jerked-off can have peice of mind in knowing that what comes around will eventually kill you.
Arthur Borges says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:04 pm
So the purpose of the media campaign seems to be to prepare US opinion for a strike package against the existing leadership once enough civil warfare is underway?
By the way, the US also took down Shah Pahlavi. When Ayatollah Khomeini went into exile, it was Pres. Carter who asked Pres. Giscard d’Estaing to host him in France. If I remember correctly, Gen. Vernon Walters was paying informal visits to several senior military officers in the run-up to the shah’s flight abroad.
It wasn’t only Pres. Mossadegh.
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 8:50 pm
Believer, the Iranian people seem to be protesting against both the election results and the regime’s human rights abuses. Even if there was fraud you’re saying they shouldn’t have protested? Whether there was fraud (there is a legitimate case to be made for it as I’ve been saying) or not, the Iranian people still have a right to protest given the abuses of the regime, which you have acknowledged. Moving on, I personally would be against the US intervening in Iran by themselves. I would only accept US intervention if it was done as part of a true international/UN effort/action to stop the Iranian regime from continuing to butcher their own people (I’am assuming a Tiananmen Square-like crackdown first). Otherwise, it should be up to the Iranian people to decide. Of course, I believe private citizens like ourselves should lend their support to the opposition in such a situation though.
David says:
June 20th, 2009 at 9:52 pm
I’m sorry, but this is the most ridiculous article I’ve read all week. Have you read any of the twitter accounts from Iran? Many are in Farsi and most are bilingual in English and Farsi, including many of the activist bloggers from Iran. How would it be possible that the third largest nation of bloggers (Iran) would be illiterate in other social media tools? Illogical. You only have to read a sampling of these tweets to know that Iranian eyewitnesses are writing them both for Iranians and the world.
Here’s a sampling:
http://bit.ly/SMldq
English is not just America’s language. As an American, it may be inconceivable that one might grow being taught more than one language, but it is actually common to be taught English in many countries, in order to become more engaged in the world, much like French used to be.
The ironic thing about this article is that is so blindly America-centric even while attempting to criticize America, there is no sympathy or even recognition of the real purpose behind the struggle occurring in Iran. Completely misses any point. Terrible article.
Bernadotte says:
June 20th, 2009 at 10:22 pm
—-”to stop the Iranian regime from continuing to butcher their own people”
Are you talking about the massacre at Kent State University, HRW?
Were you so vocal following theft of the U.S. elections in 2000 and 2004?
HRW177 says:
June 20th, 2009 at 11:18 pm
As I’ve said before I’m in high school, so no I wasn’t vocal then. I’m talking about a hypothetical, but possible action that the Iranian regime may pursue. What happened at Kent State would be nothing compared to what I’m talking about here (I did reference Tiananmen Square in my last post). The Iranian Regime has surpassed the Kent State shootings in the past as well. Also how does any of this excuse the Iranian regime’s actions? Two wrongs don’t make a right after all.
HRW177 says:
June 21st, 2009 at 1:13 am
In the US, the mass media does play a major role in deciding who the next president will be, but it is even worse in Iran. The incumbent (in this case Ahmadinejad) gets the full backing and support of the state media. This in itself can be said to make any election during which there is an incumbent invalid. There is also the issue of candidates having to pass clerical approval before they can even run. This prevents anyone but conservative muslims from running (I believe constitutionally only muslims are allowed to hold high positions in the government) . In effect, one could argue every election in Iran is highly unfair, which has led Akbar Ganji, an Iranian journalist and human rights activist, to boycott all the elections. Also, why did the government shut down text messaging and cellular phone service? The Iranian government has not been forthcoming with the answers to these questions and others, so naturally this raises suspicions.
Brutha says:
June 21st, 2009 at 5:23 am
Sorry to the naive folks who think that when a country is under immiment and real threat (as opposed to all the fake ones the US shoves down your throat as justification for another invasion party), it not only has the right, but SHOULD curtail the ordinary freedoms. Just take a look at all the crackdowns on free speech (not to mention cracked heads) and other freedoms the US committed against its own citizens and people around the world. Look at all the sovereignties it crossed on a fake threat.
chartingstocks1 says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:12 am
@David..Iran HAD a democracy…in 1951 they elected Mosaddeq by a LANDSLIDE..he ran on nationalizing the country’s resources and threw out foreign oil companies (BP). Then the US and UK (English speaking country’s) funded and orchestrated a coup and installed a dictator…Again, do you really think they want OUR help?
Prem Nizar Hameed says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:17 am
Nejad won by 11m votes. Such a scale of rigging is impossible. And the verdict testifies to his committment to the villagers and the middle class, not to mention the resistance of imperialism. However, we expect more freedom to Iranian people, good relations with Iran’s neighbours and reconciliation with its crticts for the sake of development, peace and tranquility. He is known to be simple and humble in his personal life. If he applies the same qualities in his official and foreign policies, he could win the world. If he tends to listen to the world with equanimity, the world will listen to his words sincerely. On the other hand, heavy protests on Iranian streets cannot be condoned. Who is wrong, and who is right is to be proved by a system which stands for justice. In that context,Khamenei is the man to stop the crisis. But the protesters are not satisfied by the way he has approved Nejad’s victory.In democracy, people may question the authority until they get satisfactory reply .In 21st century, there is no place for war mongers. We have to love each other and try to remove the word WAR from all the lexicons. We hope Ahamedinejad and his people will become part of that campaign. Let peace doves spread their wings from every hand.
chartingstocks1 says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:18 am
@David. how about Twitter? thats not marketing directly to the US?
Do We Really Care About Democracy? « Silver Lining says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:29 am
[...] Silver Lining Food for thought « The Tale of 3 Palestinian Villages Do We Really Care About Democracy? June 21, 2009 By Charting Stocks – Charting Stocks [...]
Tex says:
June 21st, 2009 at 9:36 am
A very good essay, and I agree wholeheartedly with the author. No, we don’t really care about Democracy. We care about what is in it for us, whether it be power, influence, petroleum and gas reserves, trade agreements, military alignments, or whatever. Look at our support for Musharraf after he seized control from Pakistan’s democratically-elected leader. Powerful forces from within (and without) our government are intent on moving us into a conflict with Iran, for their own self-serving reasons. Now we have permanent U.S. military bases in Iraq, as well as the world’s largest embassy. I guess we need it for all the U.S. tourists that are pouring in to the country.
HRW177 says:
June 21st, 2009 at 10:19 am
Brutha, the Iranian regime (IRI) has been restricting freedoms for its whole existence. HROs and human rights activists including those who are Iranian like Akbar Ganji and Shirin Ebadi have come to a consensus here. There are many reports on the internet from groups like Human Rights Watch documenting these abuses. To Nizar Hameed, the main problem in Iran seems to be its poor constitutional framework that doesn’t guarantee basic freedoms and in some cases provides the basis for human rights abuses like the persecution of the Bahai because Article 13 only protects 3 religions (Jews, Christians,and Zoroastrians), while in the US the main problem is corruption. Under Ahmadinejad, the Iranian regime’s human rights abuses against its own people has gotten worse (http://www.hrw.org/sites/default/files/reports/iran0908web_0.pdf and http://www.realite-eu.org/site/apps/nlnet/content3.aspx?c=9dJBLLNkGiF&b=2315291&ct=6447799) . The margin of victory doesn’t necessarily rule out fraud when there are no election monitors to look for and report on irregularities in the way the Interior Ministry is counting and reporting the votes (http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2009/06/ayatollahs-flawed-logic.html).
Dee says:
June 21st, 2009 at 10:43 am
I was just reading al jazeera
http://english.aljazeera.net/focus/2009/06/2009620111022959219.html
They interviewed an Iranian blogger.. twitterer (?). It seems that the twitter penetration in Iran is greater than formerly stated on this blog… or am I missing something?
Dee says:
June 21st, 2009 at 10:45 am
Another question. Does anyone know where the results of the polling done by the two US pollsters and the exit polls are? I have seen them referred to but cannot find them.
Dee says:
June 21st, 2009 at 12:20 pm
I am a little curious why my question of twitter penetration in Iran was not posted.
Again I ask, where do the statics some from that say ZERO twitter penetration in Iran as Charting Stocks stated in a previous post?
It seems to contradict stuff on Al Jazerra. That is why I am asking.
Chris says:
June 21st, 2009 at 4:29 pm
Hey HRW177,
You attitude reveals the true threat to peace today. That American arrogance that you have a right to get involved and stick your nose in anybodies affairs. Why don’t you worry about all the human rights abuses America has committed and try and do something about that, and let the Iranians worry about their own problems!? Try minding your own business! I can’t believe these Americans!? Their own dictators have declared war against their own people with human rights abuses and the blatant removal of constitutional rights, yet they are STILL hooked to their television and bitching about an election in a country they know nothing about!. Or they think they know about it because their one sided dictatorship media tells them about it! I swear, Americans are clinically insane! Hey HRW177, do us all a favor and be the first in line for an H1N1 vaccination.
HRW177 says:
June 21st, 2009 at 6:41 pm
Chris, why don’t you look at my posts in some of chartingstocks’s other articles and you will see that this is not my attitude. First of all, two wrongs don’t make a right and we should care about injustices where ever they are taking place. I’ve been open about America’s human rights abuses abroad, but currently the government’s abuses domestically are nothing compared to those of the IRI. I agree that wire-tapping should stop and Obama already issued an executive order that effectively banned torture, although the details still have to be worked out. Obama is also trying to close Gitmo and major military operations in Iraq are set to end on August 31, 2010, although I realize we are going to still keep forces there. This is a start, but there is always room for improvement. Putting an end to wire-tapping and military commissions would also be encouraging. Reducing the military budget which now accounts for half of all world military spending is also a must. Still we citizens have the ability to do things like speak out against the government and follow the religion or lack there of of our choosing. Should we not be upset when other human beings are denied these rights? I’m only for US government intervention in the event of a human rights catastrophe (think Tiananmen Square scale here) and even then it should be as part of a broader international effort. Otherwise, this issue should be left up to Iranians alone although private citizens from foreign nations are allowed to and probably should lend their support to the opposition imo. Basically, this issue should be resolved by the Iranian people alone or by the international community (UN) working in conjunction with the people. The US was meant to spread democracy upon its founding, but it was meant to do so by good example and peaceful diplomacy and I am in favor of this approach. Of course, the US hasn’t provided a good example, but we should start to. As I’ve also mentioned the IRI’s human rights abuses are well-documented. This isn’t just the western media criticizing the regime nor is it just western HROs, but also Iranian human rights activists like Akbar Ganji and Shirin Ebadi have spoken out. They have been imprisoned and intimidated by the IRI for speaking out in the past. Grand Ayatollah Montazeri ( has been imprisoned as well) also has spoken out and he was Khomeini’s heir apparent before speaking out in the 80s when Khomeini was having thousands of political prisoners executed. These abuses by all indications are real and I believe there is a case for fraud, so the Iranians have a right to protest. We also have a right to support them as they struggle against the regime that is behind these abuses and that may have committed fraud. One could also argue the IRI’s constitutional framework (i.e. Article 13 only protects three minority religions, which leaves individuals a part of other faiths like the Bahai faith open to government-sanctioned persecution) makes things inherently unfair, which would also give the people another reason to protest in support of reform. Now, I apologize if I came off as arrogant in my other posts because that wasn’t my intention. I truly want the Iranian people to receive the fundamental freedoms that all people deserve.
Tony says:
June 22nd, 2009 at 8:13 am
No kind of Democracy will survive in any Islamic country. Most muslims are masochists who enjoy being abused and degraded by sadist mullahs and dictators. They believe that if their limbs and genitals and heads are chopped off, they will reach heaven faster, and that if they don’t bomb the infidels and non muslims, they would go to hell.
HRW177 says:
June 22nd, 2009 at 8:58 am
Tony, do you have any more hate to spew?
exotraxx division: discover US Disneyland - a reader dedicated to my US American friends says:
June 22nd, 2009 at 9:45 am
[...] a ‘non-political’ website, Charting Stocks, answers its own question “Do We Really Care About Democracy?” like [...]
John Burris says:
June 22nd, 2009 at 2:25 pm
ChartingStock1, may i ask why you felt obligated to filter my message of this morning, did my extensive information make you uncomfortable and you possibly felt that it degraded you personally for your comments here. if not surely you will publish my comments. i hope you are not an arm of the islamic republic of iran and scensoring information as it may serve your purpose. I’m appauled
Israeli Effort to Destabilize Iran Via Twitter #IranElection « NaturallyMadNews says:
June 23rd, 2009 at 4:31 am
[...] Do We Really Care About Democracy? #IranElection [...]
John Burris says:
June 23rd, 2009 at 5:00 am
Dear HRW:
I thouroughly enjoy reading your excerpts. I think you made indpeth progress in nailing down what is currently transpiring in and upon the Iranian nation and the world at large – looking in. This election was/is not about ahmadinejad nor mousavi, it is simply about “money and power” both of which the current Monarchy of Khamenei has very smartley planned for many years and will do what ever is necessary, to keep to them selves and keep from the Rafsanjani Dynasty to to take away from them. Mojtaba Khamenei is the at the centre of the command and control of the Khamenei Monarchy, has the IRGC (IR Revolutionaqry Guard Corps) on their payroll of domestic protection, and Russia which provides them International consultancy and support on the global front. Iran is a major player together with Russia and Belrus as main members of the newly established and soon to be announced OPEC-like GAS Consortium for the region.
I turn your attention to a memo just received from a “very” reliable source well embedded in the current Regime in Iran clearly explaining the initial hours and day following the election:
On evening of 22 Khordad 1388 (12 July 2009), the Ministry of Interior (State Department/Home Office) based on the final and definitive estimates of the result of a number of votes received from the election ballots from nationwide voting centres, officially awarded Mir-Hossein Mousavi the win election (of 10th term of the IROI presidential elections) directly to Ali Khamenei. Ali Khamenei accepted Mousavi’s victory but with the precondition that Mousavi does not rush for the announcement of his win so as to avoid causing any tensions within the government and his supporters.
At the dawn of 23 Khordad 1388 (13 June 2009) a few hours after the Ministry of Interior advised Khamenei of Mousavi’s win, immediately after morning prayers, based on plan blue printed in advance, Khamenei was taken from “Beyt Rahbari (HQ of Supreme Leader)” in Pasteur Square, Tehran and transferred to a predefined location in North of Tehran, in Aghdassieh.
While in transit to North of Tehran, the IRGC command deployed at the HQ of Supreme Leader advised Khamenei through Mojtaba Khamenei (his son) that the reason for this transfer is because of a “Condition Grey” and the transfer is as per instruction from “IRGC Motahari Central Command”. During the transit, the special force battalions 1, 2 and 3 along with protection team of Khamenei’s family and the Physical Protection Team plus in addition to the Check and Neutralize Team were completely transferred from the HQ of Supreme Leader to the destination North Tehran where Khamenei was headed.
On completion of transfer of Khamenei, the expansion of coup d’état operations (which had started the previous day) was initiated throughout the city under code name “Maneuvre Eghtedar (Authority Maneuver)”. Simultaneously with this maneuver which surprised and uncovered its true nature as a coup d’état, military and special forces coup d’état units deployed throughout the city.
Although forces behind the coup d’état code named “Maneuver Authority” all were equipped with black police uniform and the maneuver was given the tone being run by the police but the leadership and command was led by a Council which consisted of senior IRGC commanders and the head of the police force, “Ahmadi-Moghaddam”. The majority of the commanders implementing the maneuver were also commanders of the Revolutionary Guards were not police commanders. “Mojtaba” second son of Ali Khamenei represented the Supreme Leader’s Office who was in direct contact with the Council for the coordination and implementation of the coup. The Council having predicted resistance by Mir-Hossein Mousavi and his camp had prepared in advance an initial (work in progress) arrest list which was completed at later stages of the coup.
It is not clear at this juncture if on 13 June 2009, during the implementation of the coup in Tehran if Khamenei was provided with updates and progress reports with regard to the status of the coup implementation in Tehran, however, what is crystal clear is that Khamenei through his son Mojtaba was in direct contact with those in charge of the coup and that he became a supporter of the coup movement after he was bri efed earlier in the day. What is become increasingly clear is the whole planning for the coup may have been a premeditated plan by Mojtaba to remain arms length and avoid having been on record having given the initial instruction to initiate the coup and for public consumption purposes (and damage control purposes which may come in handy at a later stage) provide the impression that he/Mojtaba had only entered the scene and became aware of the coup at a later stage after the coup had become a foregone conclusion and that he/Mojtaba only became a supporter of the coup.
Quitters Stick With It. Winners Quit. | mchuge says:
July 3rd, 2009 at 9:30 pm
[...] The importance of Twitter and #iranelection called into question. [...]
charles saunders says:
July 16th, 2009 at 9:33 pm
Your article is true. What can I add except to note what former CIA AGENT and Peace activist(”Veterans for Peace” member), Ray McGovern said recently. The mobs rioting in Iran have all the earmarks of a CIA created incident!
romath says:
August 8th, 2009 at 12:04 pm
While I don’t know whether there was widespread fraud or not, tho I suspect there was, I do agree that all this reporting in the U.S. has little to do with a love of “democracy.”
Much more important in the long run, however, is seeing clearly the political substance of the conflict within Iran. At the leadership level, this is a fight, a falling out, between wings of the fundamentalist Islamic leadership. On one side is current Ayatollah Khamenei; on the other, the “reform” opposition, those who wish to restore the approach of the initial leader, Ayatollah Khomeini! To make the point more starkly, consider this opposition led by Mir Hussein Moussavi. Under Moussavi’s leadership as prime minister through the 1980s, many thousands of Kurds, women’s rights activists, leftists and labor leaders and militants were killed in prisons and thrown into mass graves, and the war against Iraq pursued. And in the late 1990s, student protests were brutally repressed by another of Moussavi’s close allies, Mohammed Katami, with his “reform” government. Another close ally of Mouusavi is Ali Rafsanjani, considered the richest man in Iran and known as the “pistachio king.” Moussavi and Rafsanjani favor “opening up” the economy through privitization and foreign (imperialist) investment (sound familiar?). Some reform movement for democracy! Unfortunately at this time, there doesn’t appear to be any organized forces among the demonstrators that are politically independent of and in opposition to these ‘reformers.’